Article: Why I Completely Changed My Family’s Long-Term Survival Plan

[ProGeek]

It's an interesting article about BOLs vs. in-town living. I find it interesting about neighbors banding together. I don't see this working long term. I don't see banding together working if one person has lots of supplies and the other's don't. If everyone has food then it works. If everyone has something to trade, it can work. If some people have nothing, I don't think it works so good. I guess I'm a pessimist.

http://www.theorganicprepper.ca/why-i-completely-changed-my-familys-long-term-survival-plan-05082017#comment-906657

[Lilburner]

It raises a lot of questions.

I think it's like anything else with prepping, "it depends".

Things could go a bunch of different ways.

[ProGeek]

I've thought a lot about this. Previously having remote land and a BOL in a farming community, my preference is for a small community. For me maintenance of my home and the BOL became too much. As stated in the article, remote land is not as safe as you think. I had lots of theft issues. Living in a big city is also out. So we have suburb/subdivisions or larger plots that are closer to some civilization. I don't buy the fictional TV show narratives, the real life ones point out that it takes a larger group to survive and protect yourself. It seems that a group of 3-5 families is enough. Again, it depends on the substitution. A grid down substitution for a prolonged period would test that group. Argentina & Bosnia still had some power, water, food, cell service, and employment. Tough times, but not total failure of infrastructure. Riots, murder, looting, food shortages, sure, but they were both more agrarian than we are. Food didn't have to be trucked 1000-2500 miles to the store or shipped in from Chile, Brazil, and Mexico. If the grid goes down, no gas, no water, trucks stop, people starve. Farmers can't farm, crops wither from no irrigation, livestock dies. It makes Argentina & Bosnia look like a vacation spot. The best alternative is to leave the country. Otherwise, hunker down for a few of months and try to be as invisible as you can.

[Lilburner]

When I first started looking at getting a BOL, I assumed I'd get something all wooded and just carve out a little hole to hide in, not even visible from space.

The further I got into it, though, the more my outlook changed. This included everything from taking advantage of the economics of existing infrastructure to the importance of agriculture, to how much privacy is too much.

I have two families of neighbors across the street and we form a cul de sac at the end of the world. There's no reason for anyone to come up there unless they're looking for something. One of them has already mentioned blocking access if worse comes to worst. They don't know it, but I'm prepping for them, too, in terms of developing more viable agricultural land than I can use, more water collection and filtration resources than I can use - even generating extra energy. Also things like communications systems (phone and radio) and perimeter alarms and such that can be used in a "community" sense. They hunt, and could thus also be called upon to provide security duty. One of the women is a caregiver.

I was apprehensive at first about having neighbors, but I'm starting to actively embrace it.

[Country Singer]

If the grid goes down, no gas, no water, trucks stop, people starve. Farmers can't farm, crops wither from no irrigation, livestock dies. It makes Argentina & Bosnia look like a vacation spot. The best alternative is to leave the country. Otherwise, hunker down for a few of months and try to be as invisible as you can.

One thing about that, in my opinion:  the difference between the U.S. and Argentina or Bosnia (or just about anywhere else) is that when their economies went down, it had some ripple effect internationally, but otherwise business pretty much continued as usual.  If our economy (and/or grid) go down, much of the rest of the world's economy does, too.  Sure, you might be able to get out of the country, but to where?  There's a good chance that everyone else, while they may still have a functioning grid, will be in complete economic upheaval as well...and along with that, a very good chance that their borders are closed.

[engineer3d]

"If the grid goes down, no gas, no water, trucks stop, people starve. Farmers can't farm, crops wither from no irrigation, livestock dies."
"Otherwise, hunker down for a few of months and try to be as invisible as you can."
Sounds like a plan to me. Stay away from the FEMA camp as long as you can. The govt. will probably provide food, water, shelter, and medical, but they'll require you let them chip you in return.
I'd rather become a hunter - gatherer until things work out and then decide what's best for me. "A hunter-gatherer is a human living in a society in which most or all food is obtained by foraging (collecting wild plants and pursuing wild animals), in contrast to agricultural societies, which rely mainly on domesticated species."

[ProGeek]

Sure, you might be able to get out of the country, but to where?  There's a good chance that everyone else, while they may still have a functioning grid, will be in complete economic upheaval as well...and along with that, a very good chance that their borders are closed.

True, not sure where, just thinking out loud.

[ProGeek]

I'd rather become a hunter - gatherer until things work out

Sounds like camping in the woods. Not for me and the family. It's doubtful that there will be any game left after Buba hunts all the dear, turkey, squirrel, then fishes out the lakes. I hope you know how to prepare racoon and possum. Then the dogs & cats.

[kappydell]

Sounds like camping in the woods. Not for me and the family. It's doubtful that there will be any game left after Buba hunts all the dear, turkey, squirrel, then fishes out the lakes. I hope you know how to prepare racoon and possum. Then the dogs & cats.
[/quote]

LOL....my late husband told me his uncle talked about how all the deer disappeared during the Great Depression...then the squirrels.....and definitely the rabbits.  His relatives survived on fish (selling the popular game fish, eating the rough fish) and less popular but still edible game (yep, possum, and skunk).  They sold the hides for money (skunk at the time was popular for coats) and ate the carcasses.  So I learned to trap, because even birds can be caught and eaten (crows are pretty stringy  but the breasts are good with BBQ sauce.)

[upacreek]

It makes sense that you'd need a community in order to survive if everything did get very bad, but my mind can't get around how to go about it.  I've opened up to very few people and get the feeling that all but one thinks I'm certifiable. If walking up to your closest friends for a frank discussion is this difficult, I can't see how discussing it with neighbors would fare better.  Forget the relatives!  My siblings all think our babysitters will do all for us if anything bad happens to us for an infinite period of time.

How do you guys do it?

[Starlady]

Although I haven't had 'the full discussion' yet, I've found neighbors more amenable to being eased that way - after all, we live in the country for most of the same reasons, than family (who MUST live within 30 minutes of a Mall).

Even though I broached the subject carefully, at one point, I was paranoid one relative would try to have me declared certifiable and take it all away.  They've all mostly come around to understanding my hurricane and Snowmaggedon experiences but not a one of them really knows what I have.  I just don't trust their kids' big mouths. 

[upacreek]

Certifiable is an overstatement.  Most friends just think that it's way overboard.  These are the same friends that come to me if they ever need anything.  When gas was in short supply last year, one friend asked for a siphon.  When I had what he needed, he was dumbfounded and asked why I had it. Same friend routinely borrows tools as simple as crescent wrenches.  We're grown ups!  Who doesn't own a set of wrenches???

I don't trust that my relatives won't "donate" any supplies I might amass to the nearest gov't agency.  I broached the subject of one relative keeping just a single week's worth of food in her pantry for emergencies and she looked at me as if I were crazy.  She goes to her store in downtown Chicago every day or two to get whatever she needs.  The idea that Chicago could ever be without power or stores ever run out of food is insanity.  If they did, she knows the gov't is here to help.  The others are further stuck in the sand than she is.

[ProGeek]

Both my brother-in laws like to tease me about prepping. Funny, one lives in a hurricane zone and the other in tornado country. I've written them off. I talked to our neighbors a couple of years ago, one went to the LDS cannery and got some stuff, but lost interest. I'm not sure what they will do with the wheat, they don't own a grinder and have all electric appliances. We both have moved since. I don't try to convert people anymore. I really dislike the ridicule. My extended family are far enough away, they won't make it here, and I'm fine with that. My new neighbors both have young kids. I've never had the talk with them and I don't plan too.